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	<title>Comments on: BEAUTY ADDICTS: HOW TOXIC ARE YOU? Channel 4</title>
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		<title>By: 6.million.quid.man</title>
		<link>http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/comment-page-1/#comment-134706</link>
		<dc:creator>6.million.quid.man</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 09:29:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/#comment-134706</guid>
		<description>I have done a huge amount of rescearch into this subject, ever scince my older borther started doing his PhD. on artificial estrogens and their effect on cancer growth, and the main body that does the reascearch tends to play down the actual impact they may have on human health, by looking at the best case scenarios and not counting people who might be extra sensitive (this is not exclusively the case)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have done a huge amount of rescearch into this subject, ever scince my older borther started doing his PhD. on artificial estrogens and their effect on cancer growth, and the main body that does the reascearch tends to play down the actual impact they may have on human health, by looking at the best case scenarios and not counting people who might be extra sensitive (this is not exclusively the case)</p>
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		<title>By: maryanne jones</title>
		<link>http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/comment-page-1/#comment-69271</link>
		<dc:creator>maryanne jones</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Nov 2007 12:22:02 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Hmm, How about this? I suspect that most of the people reading this thread only want to know one thing; erring on the side of caution, not wanting to cause harm to myself, my loved ones,or the environment, what products are SAFEST to use, in the home or on the person, regardless of whether they are natural, organic, manmade, or even alien!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmm, How about this? I suspect that most of the people reading this thread only want to know one thing; erring on the side of caution, not wanting to cause harm to myself, my loved ones,or the environment, what products are SAFEST to use, in the home or on the person, regardless of whether they are natural, organic, manmade, or even alien!</p>
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		<title>By: John Fitzgerald</title>
		<link>http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/comment-page-1/#comment-65275</link>
		<dc:creator>John Fitzgerald</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Oct 2007 23:19:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/#comment-65275</guid>
		<description>I am fed up of all this vacous talk about whether this synthetic chemical or that synthetic chemical is not toxic or is wonderfully benign. All this nit picking is taking place while our world is going down the tubes. UNEP&#039;s recently published Global Environment Outlook states clearly that &quot;there is a  risk that environmental damage could pass unknown points of no return.&quot; Contaminated water is the greatest single cause of human disease and death the report says. The chemical industry has played major part in this toxic outcome and is still dragging its heels, frustrating international efforts to ban the use of priority chemicals and dangerous substances, as well as efforts to find more benign alternatives to them.
Profnick, I don&#039;t need further proof that these concoctions interfere with the delicately balanced systems of our living planet. Their notoriety is a matter of global concern now. I am glad to see you consider yourself working in the field of environmental chemistry. I have heard of Phytochemistry and green chemistry but not &quot;environmental chemistry&quot; Like environmental engineering, bit of an oxymoron I&#039;d say?
The irony of synthetic chemicals was outlined in Death By Medicine -Gary Null, PhD; Carolyn Dean MD, ND; Martin Feldman, MD; Debora Rasio, MD; and Dorothy Smith, PhD. Iatrogenesis, or death by healing, is a grotesque ironic examination of the medical professions. To qoute the paper &quot;Medicine is not taking into consideration the following critically important aspects of a healthy human organism: (a) stress and how it adversely affects the immune system and life processes; (b) insufficient exercise; (c) excessive caloric intake; (d) highly processed and denatured foods grown in denatured and chemically damaged soil; and (e) exposure to tens of thousands of environmental toxins. Instead of minimizing these disease-causing factors, we cause more illness through medical technology, diagnostic testing, overuse of medical and surgical procedures, and overuse of pharmaceutical drugs. The huge disservice of this therapeutic strategy is the result of little effort or money being spent on preventing disease.&quot;

To end, we have reached the point of saturation with prescription drugs. Every body of water tested contains measurable drug residues. The tons of antibiotics used in animal farming, which run off into the water table and surrounding bodies of water, are conferring antibiotic resistance to germs in sewage, and these germs also are found in our water supply. Flushed down our toilets are tons of drugs and drug metabolites that also find their way into our water supply. We have no way to know the long-term health consequences of ingesting a mixture of drugs and drug-breakdown products. These drugs represent another level of iatrogenic disease that we are unable to completely measure. 

It is becoming clearer, that the blind faith in the varieties of &quot;new alchemy&quot; are not meeting the needs of our perceived vision of a desirable world and only represent a threat to the human project itself.

We need a massive paradigm shift pretty quickly</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am fed up of all this vacous talk about whether this synthetic chemical or that synthetic chemical is not toxic or is wonderfully benign. All this nit picking is taking place while our world is going down the tubes. UNEP&#8217;s recently published Global Environment Outlook states clearly that &#8220;there is a  risk that environmental damage could pass unknown points of no return.&#8221; Contaminated water is the greatest single cause of human disease and death the report says. The chemical industry has played major part in this toxic outcome and is still dragging its heels, frustrating international efforts to ban the use of priority chemicals and dangerous substances, as well as efforts to find more benign alternatives to them.<br />
Profnick, I don&#8217;t need further proof that these concoctions interfere with the delicately balanced systems of our living planet. Their notoriety is a matter of global concern now. I am glad to see you consider yourself working in the field of environmental chemistry. I have heard of Phytochemistry and green chemistry but not &#8220;environmental chemistry&#8221; Like environmental engineering, bit of an oxymoron I&#8217;d say?<br />
The irony of synthetic chemicals was outlined in Death By Medicine -Gary Null, PhD; Carolyn Dean MD, ND; Martin Feldman, MD; Debora Rasio, MD; and Dorothy Smith, PhD. Iatrogenesis, or death by healing, is a grotesque ironic examination of the medical professions. To qoute the paper &#8220;Medicine is not taking into consideration the following critically important aspects of a healthy human organism: (a) stress and how it adversely affects the immune system and life processes; (b) insufficient exercise; (c) excessive caloric intake; (d) highly processed and denatured foods grown in denatured and chemically damaged soil; and (e) exposure to tens of thousands of environmental toxins. Instead of minimizing these disease-causing factors, we cause more illness through medical technology, diagnostic testing, overuse of medical and surgical procedures, and overuse of pharmaceutical drugs. The huge disservice of this therapeutic strategy is the result of little effort or money being spent on preventing disease.&#8221;</p>
<p>To end, we have reached the point of saturation with prescription drugs. Every body of water tested contains measurable drug residues. The tons of antibiotics used in animal farming, which run off into the water table and surrounding bodies of water, are conferring antibiotic resistance to germs in sewage, and these germs also are found in our water supply. Flushed down our toilets are tons of drugs and drug metabolites that also find their way into our water supply. We have no way to know the long-term health consequences of ingesting a mixture of drugs and drug-breakdown products. These drugs represent another level of iatrogenic disease that we are unable to completely measure. </p>
<p>It is becoming clearer, that the blind faith in the varieties of &#8220;new alchemy&#8221; are not meeting the needs of our perceived vision of a desirable world and only represent a threat to the human project itself.</p>
<p>We need a massive paradigm shift pretty quickly</p>
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		<title>By: profnick</title>
		<link>http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/comment-page-1/#comment-64951</link>
		<dc:creator>profnick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Oct 2007 16:31:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/#comment-64951</guid>
		<description>&quot;It is obvious profnick your background is in chemistry&quot;
err... thought we were talking about chemicals John, that kinda gives my background some relevance. Actually my background (plus 30 years experience) is in environmental chemistry. The rest of your post is just hyperbole with no attempt to separate evidence from anecdote. The fact that we probably agree on much of this has obviously bypassed you but then if you don&#039;t read the posts then what should we expect.
&quot;The only thing that is “out of context” is the notion that lab rats in a cloud of hubris can improve on nature. That is the “nonsense” that will condemn us all to toxic hell.&quot;

Sound and fury signifying nothing.

&quot;Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) has identified the basic toxicity of only seven percent of the most frequently manufactured chemicals in the US and we haven’t yet even got near to analysing the “cocktail effect”&quot;
Close to the truth but if we have little evidence on the remaining 93% why do you have to add &quot;sinister synthetics&quot; because you can&#039;t know can you? The &quot;cocktail effects will never be studied directly because of the inherent problems in methodology so outright bans in the case of doubt is the best practice, and it&#039;s called the precautionary principle and is the basis of OECD chemicals legislation). 
&quot;It was heartening to see, after they stopped using the chemical “nasties”, how the toxins were eliminated from the two female volounteers in programme no 1 and from the female teenager in programme 2. Also they felt much better healthwise, had more self-confidence and were financially better off. What more proof is needed?&quot;

Do you know what proof is John? This is anecdote. when you&#039;ve learned the difference maybe we can continue to debate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;It is obvious profnick your background is in chemistry&#8221;<br />
err&#8230; thought we were talking about chemicals John, that kinda gives my background some relevance. Actually my background (plus 30 years experience) is in environmental chemistry. The rest of your post is just hyperbole with no attempt to separate evidence from anecdote. The fact that we probably agree on much of this has obviously bypassed you but then if you don&#8217;t read the posts then what should we expect.<br />
&#8220;The only thing that is “out of context” is the notion that lab rats in a cloud of hubris can improve on nature. That is the “nonsense” that will condemn us all to toxic hell.&#8221;</p>
<p>Sound and fury signifying nothing.</p>
<p>&#8220;Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) has identified the basic toxicity of only seven percent of the most frequently manufactured chemicals in the US and we haven’t yet even got near to analysing the “cocktail effect”&#8221;<br />
Close to the truth but if we have little evidence on the remaining 93% why do you have to add &#8220;sinister synthetics&#8221; because you can&#8217;t know can you? The &#8220;cocktail effects will never be studied directly because of the inherent problems in methodology so outright bans in the case of doubt is the best practice, and it&#8217;s called the precautionary principle and is the basis of OECD chemicals legislation).<br />
&#8220;It was heartening to see, after they stopped using the chemical “nasties”, how the toxins were eliminated from the two female volounteers in programme no 1 and from the female teenager in programme 2. Also they felt much better healthwise, had more self-confidence and were financially better off. What more proof is needed?&#8221;</p>
<p>Do you know what proof is John? This is anecdote. when you&#8217;ve learned the difference maybe we can continue to debate.</p>
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		<title>By: John Fitzgerald</title>
		<link>http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/comment-page-1/#comment-60323</link>
		<dc:creator>John Fitzgerald</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Oct 2007 15:09:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/#comment-60323</guid>
		<description>Hi Dave,
Thank you for the helpful info. It will add add to the growing documentation that man-made chemicals are out of control, threatening our health and environment. 
Even the technology we are using to get the message across contains toxic chemicals and heavy metals that cannot be disposed of or recycled safely. We also have to pressure leading electronic companies for change to turn back the toxic tide of e-waste that is accumulating everywhere.
Stricter environmental regulations in developed countries have led to many polluting industries transferring their toxic technologies to the developing nations, starting the problem all over again elsewhere.
It is worth noting that U.S. companies released 38 million pounds of toxic chemicals into the air and water that are known or suspected to cause reproductive disorders and that since the Bush administrations &quot;watering down&quot; of regulations, companies won&#039;t have to self-report that data as thoroughly as before. (Colorado Public Interest Research Group (CoPIRG),2007. Furthermore, and even more alarming, the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) has identified the basic toxicity of only seven percent of the most frequently manufactured chemicals in the US and we haven&#039;t yet even got near to analysing the &quot;cocktail effect&quot; of these sinister synthetics. 
It was heartening to see, after they stopped using the chemical &quot;nasties&quot;, how the toxins were eliminated from the two female volounteers in programme no 1 and from the female teenager in programme 2. Also they felt much better healthwise, had more self-confidence and were financially better off. What more proof is needed? 
Keep the vigilence going.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Dave,<br />
Thank you for the helpful info. It will add add to the growing documentation that man-made chemicals are out of control, threatening our health and environment.<br />
Even the technology we are using to get the message across contains toxic chemicals and heavy metals that cannot be disposed of or recycled safely. We also have to pressure leading electronic companies for change to turn back the toxic tide of e-waste that is accumulating everywhere.<br />
Stricter environmental regulations in developed countries have led to many polluting industries transferring their toxic technologies to the developing nations, starting the problem all over again elsewhere.<br />
It is worth noting that U.S. companies released 38 million pounds of toxic chemicals into the air and water that are known or suspected to cause reproductive disorders and that since the Bush administrations &#8220;watering down&#8221; of regulations, companies won&#8217;t have to self-report that data as thoroughly as before. (Colorado Public Interest Research Group (CoPIRG),2007. Furthermore, and even more alarming, the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) has identified the basic toxicity of only seven percent of the most frequently manufactured chemicals in the US and we haven&#8217;t yet even got near to analysing the &#8220;cocktail effect&#8221; of these sinister synthetics.<br />
It was heartening to see, after they stopped using the chemical &#8220;nasties&#8221;, how the toxins were eliminated from the two female volounteers in programme no 1 and from the female teenager in programme 2. Also they felt much better healthwise, had more self-confidence and were financially better off. What more proof is needed?<br />
Keep the vigilence going.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave says:</title>
		<link>http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/comment-page-1/#comment-59689</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave says:</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Oct 2007 16:54:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/#comment-59689</guid>
		<description>Hi John
You have made some interesting posts here that have been good to read.

I think this is also quiet relevant:
&quot;Although the hormonal changes in the boys were linked to phthalate monoester levels in breast milk, we cannot exclude that fetal exposure may be a contributing factor to altered postnatal hormone levels. Levels of phthalate monoesters in breast milk may be a proxy of general maternal exposure: the women with high levels of phthalate monoesters in milk may also be among those with highest exposures during pregnancy. Phthalates can cross the placenta; DEHP and mEHP have been detected in maternal and cord blood (Latini et al. 2003) and their metabolites were found in amniotic fluid (Silva et al. 2004c). Sources of phthalate exposures in women can be inhalation (Adibi et al. 2003), contamination via building materials and furniture, use of consumer products including cosmetics (Koo and Lee 2004), and food items (Anderson et al. 2001). Thus, exposure to some phthalates such as DEHP and DiNP is likely to be constant rather than episodic, whereas others such as DMP and DEP, through their presence in cosmetics, are more influenced by personal habits.&quot;

it comes from:
http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?tool=pubmed&amp;pubmedid=16451866
Human Breast Milk Contamination with Phthalates and Alterations of Endogenous Reproductive Hormones in Infants Three Months of Age
Katharina M. Main, Gerda K. Mortensen, Marko M. Kaleva, Kirsten A. Boisen, Ida N. Damgaard, Marla Chellakooty, Ida M. Schmidt, Anne-Maarit Suomi, Helena E. Virtanen, Jørgen H. Petersen, Anna-Maria Andersson, Jorma Toppari, and Niels E. Skakkebæk
Environ Health Perspect. 2006 February; 114(2): 270–276.

Dave</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi John<br />
You have made some interesting posts here that have been good to read.</p>
<p>I think this is also quiet relevant:<br />
&#8220;Although the hormonal changes in the boys were linked to phthalate monoester levels in breast milk, we cannot exclude that fetal exposure may be a contributing factor to altered postnatal hormone levels. Levels of phthalate monoesters in breast milk may be a proxy of general maternal exposure: the women with high levels of phthalate monoesters in milk may also be among those with highest exposures during pregnancy. Phthalates can cross the placenta; DEHP and mEHP have been detected in maternal and cord blood (Latini et al. 2003) and their metabolites were found in amniotic fluid (Silva et al. 2004c). Sources of phthalate exposures in women can be inhalation (Adibi et al. 2003), contamination via building materials and furniture, use of consumer products including cosmetics (Koo and Lee 2004), and food items (Anderson et al. 2001). Thus, exposure to some phthalates such as DEHP and DiNP is likely to be constant rather than episodic, whereas others such as DMP and DEP, through their presence in cosmetics, are more influenced by personal habits.&#8221;</p>
<p>it comes from:<br />
<a href="http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?tool=pubmed&amp;pubmedid=16451866" rel="nofollow">http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?tool=pubmed&amp;pubmedid=16451866</a><br />
Human Breast Milk Contamination with Phthalates and Alterations of Endogenous Reproductive Hormones in Infants Three Months of Age<br />
Katharina M. Main, Gerda K. Mortensen, Marko M. Kaleva, Kirsten A. Boisen, Ida N. Damgaard, Marla Chellakooty, Ida M. Schmidt, Anne-Maarit Suomi, Helena E. Virtanen, Jørgen H. Petersen, Anna-Maria Andersson, Jorma Toppari, and Niels E. Skakkebæk<br />
Environ Health Perspect. 2006 February; 114(2): 270–276.</p>
<p>Dave</p>
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		<title>By: John Fitzgerald</title>
		<link>http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/comment-page-1/#comment-59346</link>
		<dc:creator>John Fitzgerald</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Oct 2007 18:53:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/#comment-59346</guid>
		<description>There seems to be a lot of pride, predjudice and pathology getting into this exchange. It is obvious profnick your background is in chemistry. You can cease being pedantic. I was giving an ecological explaination of the biological functioning of a substance. Obviously if we ingest a substance its constituents follow many metabolic pathways in our bodies. The lead in petrol before it was banned, for example was known to follow the same metabolic pathway as calcium. Its replacement is also under scrutiny for its toxic threat. Forget about lethal dose and safe limits lark also. Long-term exposure to small doses can have deleterious effects on our health. Right now most responsible governments are just getting to grips with the toxic legacy of our synthetic environment. There is still a long way to go but the momentum is gaining strength and it nedds no artificial stimulus either. The only thing that is &quot;out of context&quot; is the notion that lab rats in a cloud of hubris can improve on nature. That is the &quot;nonsense&quot; that will condemn us all to toxic hell.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There seems to be a lot of pride, predjudice and pathology getting into this exchange. It is obvious profnick your background is in chemistry. You can cease being pedantic. I was giving an ecological explaination of the biological functioning of a substance. Obviously if we ingest a substance its constituents follow many metabolic pathways in our bodies. The lead in petrol before it was banned, for example was known to follow the same metabolic pathway as calcium. Its replacement is also under scrutiny for its toxic threat. Forget about lethal dose and safe limits lark also. Long-term exposure to small doses can have deleterious effects on our health. Right now most responsible governments are just getting to grips with the toxic legacy of our synthetic environment. There is still a long way to go but the momentum is gaining strength and it nedds no artificial stimulus either. The only thing that is &#8220;out of context&#8221; is the notion that lab rats in a cloud of hubris can improve on nature. That is the &#8220;nonsense&#8221; that will condemn us all to toxic hell.</p>
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		<title>By: profnick</title>
		<link>http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/comment-page-1/#comment-59193</link>
		<dc:creator>profnick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Oct 2007 16:24:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/#comment-59193</guid>
		<description>John,
At the risk of further derailing this thread, I have to respond to your post.
&quot;In its simplest sense a substance having a “biological function” means it will totally decompose leaving only valuable nutrients that then form part of the global biogeochemical cycle.&quot; 
This is not what biological functionality is. A compound is said to be biologically functional when it takes part in a metabolic pathway or other normal physiological event. What you describe is the ability of a compound to undergo catabolism, (breakdown) by biological systems.
&quot;If the conatminant or toxin is taken up it bioaccumulates causing huge problems at the apex of the food chain. &quot; This is only true of a small number of compounds; the vast majority of chemicals are effectively catabolised by a range of enzymes such as cytochrome P450 mixed function oxidases, hydrolases, glutathione-S transferases and others.So bioaccumulation is very much the exception rather than the rule. We have evolved such enzyme systems to cope with the wide range of chemical types that occur in natural substances. Citrus peel for example contains over 120 chemicals. Some of which are potentially toxic and need to be broken down in our bodies.

The only issue with any chemical, natural or synthetic is the dose at which harm may be caused.
Why is natural &quot;simple&quot;?; I have already explained that essential oils contain hundred of chemicals that have never been tested. I suggest you look at the properties of some naturally occuring substance on the USDA Ethnobotanical and Phytochemical Database, (http://www.ars-grin.gov/cgi-bin/duke/farmacy-scroll3.pl
For example try searching for lemon and have a look at some of the properties of the many constituents.
Your explanation of the leaving group of parabens metabolism is also inaccurate. For example you say &quot;Methyl paraben may degrade releasing methanol, a potentially toxic chemical.&quot;. Parabens are in fact very readily degraded in the body by esterases and the &quot;leaving group&quot; (the alcohol, methanol, propanol etc depending on the parabens) is further rapidly degraded by dehydrogenases. Thus even the tiny amount of methanol you acknowledge as being likely to be released will be rapidly broken down. I could use similar counter arguments for your other examples but it would be too tedious to contemplate. However your post does highlight the reason why we have this &quot;tiresome “to and fro” of chemically charged argument,&quot;; because it is important that the science is accurately reported and put into context, exactly why this programme, (to bring us back to the thread) was so irresponsible.
You say &quot;it is the people in the end who will decide what is best for them.&quot;, but I hope they do so with the best available evidence and not out of context nonsense. The two key factors to remember are:
1. Natural doesn&#039;t necessarily mean simple or best
2. Dose is the only determinant of &quot;toxicity&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John,<br />
At the risk of further derailing this thread, I have to respond to your post.<br />
&#8220;In its simplest sense a substance having a “biological function” means it will totally decompose leaving only valuable nutrients that then form part of the global biogeochemical cycle.&#8221;<br />
This is not what biological functionality is. A compound is said to be biologically functional when it takes part in a metabolic pathway or other normal physiological event. What you describe is the ability of a compound to undergo catabolism, (breakdown) by biological systems.<br />
&#8220;If the conatminant or toxin is taken up it bioaccumulates causing huge problems at the apex of the food chain. &#8221; This is only true of a small number of compounds; the vast majority of chemicals are effectively catabolised by a range of enzymes such as cytochrome P450 mixed function oxidases, hydrolases, glutathione-S transferases and others.So bioaccumulation is very much the exception rather than the rule. We have evolved such enzyme systems to cope with the wide range of chemical types that occur in natural substances. Citrus peel for example contains over 120 chemicals. Some of which are potentially toxic and need to be broken down in our bodies.</p>
<p>The only issue with any chemical, natural or synthetic is the dose at which harm may be caused.<br />
Why is natural &#8220;simple&#8221;?; I have already explained that essential oils contain hundred of chemicals that have never been tested. I suggest you look at the properties of some naturally occuring substance on the USDA Ethnobotanical and Phytochemical Database, (<a href="http://www.ars-grin.gov/cgi-bin/duke/farmacy-scroll3.pl" rel="nofollow">http://www.ars-grin.gov/cgi-bin/duke/farmacy-scroll3.pl</a><br />
For example try searching for lemon and have a look at some of the properties of the many constituents.<br />
Your explanation of the leaving group of parabens metabolism is also inaccurate. For example you say &#8220;Methyl paraben may degrade releasing methanol, a potentially toxic chemical.&#8221;. Parabens are in fact very readily degraded in the body by esterases and the &#8220;leaving group&#8221; (the alcohol, methanol, propanol etc depending on the parabens) is further rapidly degraded by dehydrogenases. Thus even the tiny amount of methanol you acknowledge as being likely to be released will be rapidly broken down. I could use similar counter arguments for your other examples but it would be too tedious to contemplate. However your post does highlight the reason why we have this &#8220;tiresome “to and fro” of chemically charged argument,&#8221;; because it is important that the science is accurately reported and put into context, exactly why this programme, (to bring us back to the thread) was so irresponsible.<br />
You say &#8220;it is the people in the end who will decide what is best for them.&#8221;, but I hope they do so with the best available evidence and not out of context nonsense. The two key factors to remember are:<br />
1. Natural doesn&#8217;t necessarily mean simple or best<br />
2. Dose is the only determinant of &#8220;toxicity&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: John Fitzgerald</title>
		<link>http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/comment-page-1/#comment-58151</link>
		<dc:creator>John Fitzgerald</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Oct 2007 19:42:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/#comment-58151</guid>
		<description>In its simplest sense a substance having a &quot;biological function&quot; means it will totally decompose leaving only valuable nutrients that then form part of the global biogeochemical cycle. Macronutrients like calcium are taken up by plants and animals and returned to the cycle when they die. Micronutriets such as boron are also cycled in the same way. Synthetic ingredients do not have this beneficial function and serve only to contaminate and cause systemic dysfunction in most living matter. If the conatminant or toxin is taken up it bioaccumulates causing huge problems at the apex of the food chain. Seeing as I have limited space and time I will end the with the example of a substance in synthetic laundry detergents called nonylphenol etoxylates. Thes surfacants which detergent manufacturers say are 95% degradeable in septic tanks forget to state that the 95% degradeability are the etoxyalates but it is the 5% nonylphenols that persist as active surfacants in the system for a lenghty time, causing eventual failure and rendering the effluent more toxic than the influent.  

On a helpful note, Smart Skin Care.com list a few ingredients which may be capable of causing skin damage with prolonged use, or are simply redundant. They also offer a direct service in the US or Canada, to a medical doctor who is a skin care specialist. I don&#039;t know if there is a similar one in the UK or EU: 

Imidazolidinyl Urea and Diazolidinyl Urea: Used as preservatives to prevent bacterial growth although ineffective against fungi. Known to be a relatively common cause of contact dermatitis. Two trade names for these chemicals are Germall II and Germall 115. Germall 115 may release formaldehyde, a potentially toxic chemical. Potential for low level skin damage in the long term is unproven but appears likely. 

Sodium Lauryl Sulfate: A detergent common in shampoos and cleaners, where it is relatively safe due to short contact time. If exposure is prolonged is likely to cause skin irritation, dryness and other damage. In fact, sodium lauryl sulfate is sometimes used as a model skin irritant in the experiments where skin protectors are tested. Avoid products with sodium lauryl sulfate unless time of contact with the skin is very short. Even skin cleansers should rather be without it. 

Mineral oil: petroleum derived hydrocarbons; used as inexpensive base in some products (less today than in the past). Is moderately comedogenic. Mineral oil may also interfere with normal perspiration and other skin functions. 

Synthetic Colors: Whether synthetic colors are completely safe or mildly damaging in the long run is unknown. Since they serve no useful purpose, they are best avoided (except perhaps when avoiding them means foregoing an otherwise great product). They are labeled as FD&amp;C or D&amp;C, followed by a color and a number, e.g. FD&amp;C Red No. 6 or D&amp;C Green No. 6. Some are found to be mutagens in rodents.

Synthetic Fragrances: There are over 200 synthetic fragrances used in cosmetics. There is no way to know which particular ones are in your product, since on the label it will simply say &quot;Fragrance.&quot; Safety of most synthetic fragrances is an open question. Best to avoid them since they provide no skin benefits. True, it is good to have a nice smelling cream. However, apart from the questionable safety, frangrance may mask spoilage of your product, an effect you would want to avoid. 

Ethanolamines (Monoethanolamine aka MEA, Diethanolamine aka DEA, Triethanolamine aka TEA): common pH stabilizers; when exposed to oxygen/air form nitrosoamines, which may be irritating and/or toxic. The amount of nitrosoamines formed during typical use of skin care products with ethanolamines is unclear. 

Parabens (e.g. Methyl, Ethyl, Propyl and Butyl Paraben): Used as preservatives; inhibit microbial growth and extend shelf life of products. Methyl paraben may degrade releasing methanol, a potentially toxic chemical. However, the amounts of methanol that might be released from methyl paraben in skin care products are too small for any known systemic effects. Most people don&#039;t have an obvious skin reaction to parabens. However, more research is needed to determine whether they are truly nontoxic or may cause low level skin damage in the long term.

With all this tiresome  &quot;to and fro&quot; of chemically charged argument, it is the people in the end who will decide what is best for them. I just hope they will come out on the side of the natural and simple in all its incontestable benefits and the cult of &quot;sorcorers apprentices&quot; will not prevail.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In its simplest sense a substance having a &#8220;biological function&#8221; means it will totally decompose leaving only valuable nutrients that then form part of the global biogeochemical cycle. Macronutrients like calcium are taken up by plants and animals and returned to the cycle when they die. Micronutriets such as boron are also cycled in the same way. Synthetic ingredients do not have this beneficial function and serve only to contaminate and cause systemic dysfunction in most living matter. If the conatminant or toxin is taken up it bioaccumulates causing huge problems at the apex of the food chain. Seeing as I have limited space and time I will end the with the example of a substance in synthetic laundry detergents called nonylphenol etoxylates. Thes surfacants which detergent manufacturers say are 95% degradeable in septic tanks forget to state that the 95% degradeability are the etoxyalates but it is the 5% nonylphenols that persist as active surfacants in the system for a lenghty time, causing eventual failure and rendering the effluent more toxic than the influent.  </p>
<p>On a helpful note, Smart Skin Care.com list a few ingredients which may be capable of causing skin damage with prolonged use, or are simply redundant. They also offer a direct service in the US or Canada, to a medical doctor who is a skin care specialist. I don&#8217;t know if there is a similar one in the UK or EU: </p>
<p>Imidazolidinyl Urea and Diazolidinyl Urea: Used as preservatives to prevent bacterial growth although ineffective against fungi. Known to be a relatively common cause of contact dermatitis. Two trade names for these chemicals are Germall II and Germall 115. Germall 115 may release formaldehyde, a potentially toxic chemical. Potential for low level skin damage in the long term is unproven but appears likely. </p>
<p>Sodium Lauryl Sulfate: A detergent common in shampoos and cleaners, where it is relatively safe due to short contact time. If exposure is prolonged is likely to cause skin irritation, dryness and other damage. In fact, sodium lauryl sulfate is sometimes used as a model skin irritant in the experiments where skin protectors are tested. Avoid products with sodium lauryl sulfate unless time of contact with the skin is very short. Even skin cleansers should rather be without it. </p>
<p>Mineral oil: petroleum derived hydrocarbons; used as inexpensive base in some products (less today than in the past). Is moderately comedogenic. Mineral oil may also interfere with normal perspiration and other skin functions. </p>
<p>Synthetic Colors: Whether synthetic colors are completely safe or mildly damaging in the long run is unknown. Since they serve no useful purpose, they are best avoided (except perhaps when avoiding them means foregoing an otherwise great product). They are labeled as FD&amp;C or D&amp;C, followed by a color and a number, e.g. FD&amp;C Red No. 6 or D&amp;C Green No. 6. Some are found to be mutagens in rodents.</p>
<p>Synthetic Fragrances: There are over 200 synthetic fragrances used in cosmetics. There is no way to know which particular ones are in your product, since on the label it will simply say &#8220;Fragrance.&#8221; Safety of most synthetic fragrances is an open question. Best to avoid them since they provide no skin benefits. True, it is good to have a nice smelling cream. However, apart from the questionable safety, frangrance may mask spoilage of your product, an effect you would want to avoid. </p>
<p>Ethanolamines (Monoethanolamine aka MEA, Diethanolamine aka DEA, Triethanolamine aka TEA): common pH stabilizers; when exposed to oxygen/air form nitrosoamines, which may be irritating and/or toxic. The amount of nitrosoamines formed during typical use of skin care products with ethanolamines is unclear. </p>
<p>Parabens (e.g. Methyl, Ethyl, Propyl and Butyl Paraben): Used as preservatives; inhibit microbial growth and extend shelf life of products. Methyl paraben may degrade releasing methanol, a potentially toxic chemical. However, the amounts of methanol that might be released from methyl paraben in skin care products are too small for any known systemic effects. Most people don&#8217;t have an obvious skin reaction to parabens. However, more research is needed to determine whether they are truly nontoxic or may cause low level skin damage in the long term.</p>
<p>With all this tiresome  &#8220;to and fro&#8221; of chemically charged argument, it is the people in the end who will decide what is best for them. I just hope they will come out on the side of the natural and simple in all its incontestable benefits and the cult of &#8220;sorcorers apprentices&#8221; will not prevail.</p>
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		<title>By: profnick</title>
		<link>http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/comment-page-1/#comment-58138</link>
		<dc:creator>profnick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Oct 2007 16:53:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.unrealitytv.co.uk/reality-tv/beauty-addicts-how-toxic-are-you-channel-4/#comment-58138</guid>
		<description>John,
No dispute over the need to investigate potential hazards. My beef was with the way in which factoids were presented in the programme as facts. 
I don&#039;t understand your statement  &quot;The synthetic ingredients that are in personal/household products and toiletries have no “biological function” and many of them persist and remain active in our bodies and the environment.&quot; Maybe you can explain or give some examples.
Have you noticed how most of your references are 20-30 years old? I would have assumed that the OECD/WHO meta analysis of 1997 have taken the earlier stuff into account?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John,<br />
No dispute over the need to investigate potential hazards. My beef was with the way in which factoids were presented in the programme as facts.<br />
I don&#8217;t understand your statement  &#8220;The synthetic ingredients that are in personal/household products and toiletries have no “biological function” and many of them persist and remain active in our bodies and the environment.&#8221; Maybe you can explain or give some examples.<br />
Have you noticed how most of your references are 20-30 years old? I would have assumed that the OECD/WHO meta analysis of 1997 have taken the earlier stuff into account?</p>
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